From a none too pleased employee of the Queen:
RBS in Stamford got the conference call after the “Oh, we’re taking more money from the UK government” news yesterday. (No one understood we why needed more money.) Anyway, since in 2008 the bonuses were deferred until June 2010 (and then, only 1/3 was getting paid out, and then, only in paper), now 2009 will not be paid until June 2010 (typically it was March of the following year)…and they are “unsure” if it will be ANY cash at all. It would be paid in RBS debt. Everyone is extremely unhappy.So now, the last time (RBS) Greenwich Capital people got paid a bonus was March 2008 (for calendar 2007) and the next time we’ll get anything will be June 2010. Base salaries only for what will be over 2 years. There has been more than 1 personal bankruptcy filing by employees (traders).
Hard to tell if the UK is just jerking us around, making us think we’ll get cash when we won’t; or if they’re just being honest when they say they just don’t know. Machiavellian or just disorganized? Probably the latter.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 11:54AM
FYI, in our next published thesaurus, we are adding a new word for "deferred". It will be "never".
~Webster's Thesaurus Development Team
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 11:56AM
@1 great idea!
-queen E
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 11:58AM
are they subletting space int he building yet? Cause I've always wanted to work near the lovely gentlemen loitering outside the dmv on any given day. The cross reference btn that crown and the Wee Burn boys is remarkable...
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 11:58AM
total bull shit.
-fred goodwin
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 11:58AM
There is a reason it is called a "bonus".
Posted by Meatbone9 , Nov 04, 2009 11:59AM
No really companies that aren't allowed to pay competitive salaries and bonuses will be able to keep talent...yup...so as traders do you short the stock here and go long bonus paper and hope for a bankruptcy? That sucks, and I don't mean that in a sarcastic your pain is my joy DB comment sort of way.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 11:59AM
@5 asshole
-bankrupt rbs trader
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:01PM
jesus would not approve of this.
Posted by Investorcluzo , Nov 04, 2009 12:01PM
can I get a quote on rbs bonus default swaps?
-j paulson
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:02PM
Why dont these bankrupt traders go elsewhere then? If this is all true I do fel bad, that sucks for all involved, massive pain caused by the sins of the few, etc. However people have been living above their means it sounds like...
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:02PM
The story and comments so far bring to mind a great joke about the Queen appearing on a charity performance of the game show, "Password".......I think that joke is quite popular in the health industry and among some crude oil marketing departments where traders with several decades of experience are employed. If you have any contacts in those spheres of influence you might learn the joke. Equine anatomy is involved in the punchline.
~The Joke Briefer
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:04PM
@10 it's not a matter of living above one's means...as someone who works in finance, you generally expect that your salary will be a very small percentage of your overall comp...and now, we've just been getting that.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:05PM
@10: where do they (or any traders) go? Not like anyone is hiring hundreds of traders and offering "make-wholes" on the deferred bonuses.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:06PM
@12, I work in finance. Declaring personal bankruptcy suggests you have been living above your means. Also, living off of expected comp is always a stupid way to go, sad but true.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:06PM
Why is my groin on fire?
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:07PM
@13 has it correct...they're probably holding out, waiting to get paid in a few months (hopefully), and then looking elsewhere.
Posted by European Bear , Nov 04, 2009 12:08PM
@ exactly. You have been expecting bonuses, but you are not entitled to them.
I guess it's that sense of entitlement that enrages so many people outside the finance industry.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:08PM
brutal.
kidding, this is hilarious to me.
-fred "cant spell my name without the word god" goodwin
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:08PM
I keep hearing Asian markets need financial traders bad. Big soiree going on today in the Far East today as a bunch 'o traders are partying it up. Bastards.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:09PM
Well, these pay policies sounds like sound business practices to me.
As long as mgmt gets paid, the producers can go suck eggs.
That's the Charlotte way and it worked out tremendously for our stockholders.
-KL
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:10PM
----fred "cant spell my name without the word god" goodwin----
nice.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:11PM
@12.
I thought people in finance were smart enough about finance to know that depending on your bonus to pay your expenses is about as amateur as it got.
That's pretty 101 level knowledge.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:11PM
Good news is by the time they are able to afford a new car, the new Chryslers will be out
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:12PM
@23: used Trabant is more like it.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:12PM
I work at Jefferies.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:14PM
not getting a bonus for 2 years and then getting it all paid in debt is the new killing it.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:16PM
Bess, what are you going to spend your bonus on?
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:17PM
News flash - not every trader at a bank qualifies as "talent." In the same way many a AA prospect has to eventually turn in the cleats and get a real job - so too with a metric asston of under 35 yo so-called 'traders.' Unless you work for GS - in which case you've made a profit on every trading day since April. But you own the market.
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 12:20PM
@22;
Yes, but I think its even lower than 101 level knowledge. I think its down as low as CFA level knowledge.
Well, maybe not that low, but pretty low.
Posted by Investorcluzo , Nov 04, 2009 12:22PM
@29 - what you failed to mention was that it's probably at the MBA level of knowledge. that's why the traders don't seem to get it - most just have CFAs.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:23PM
Goldman killed Jesus.
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 12:24PM
@17 = head of the Philadelphia Transit Worker's Union Local 234.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:24PM
Whats a personal budget?
-GS trader
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:30PM
Its not just traders j/off's, impacts the entire bank. I-bankers, sales, pb, etc. Not "trader" specific. PS, not all traders are "killing" it. The smartst "traders" in the world got us into this mess. I hear Cioffi was the smartest guy at Bear
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 12:30PM
Da Queen is a friend-a-mine, and I will use my enormous influence and powers of persuasion to rectify dis situation.
Just call me da Rectifier.
-cg
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:30PM
Traders add no value to the economy. Go to the horsetrack or the bookie and trade all cash
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:31PM
@34: "the smartest guy at Bear" = the tallest midget
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:35PM
Can anyone explain what a bonus payment in RBS debt is? Is that like a voucher to receive cash from RBS at a future date? Looking forward to 1 honest response and 15 sarcastic ones.
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 12:37PM
@38=cg
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:40PM
@38, it's a financing instrument, like equity, but with limited upside, generally superior to equity in the event of bankruptcy.
@36, kill yourself.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:46PM
RBS is little more than a salaried waiting room for those trying to get new jobs.
There is one upside though, as it's now a government dept, we are keeping to civil service hours. Leaving at 5 o'clock is the new killing it.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:49PM
@24 no one said it just affects traders. the "traders" part in the post refers to which employees had filed for bankrupty.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:53PM
@38, its one step above a flaming bag of dog poo
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:56PM
RBS spread dem butt cheeks so I can smells the juicy insides!
CG
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 12:57PM
I approved the new compensation scheme, and believe it will not encourage excess risk taking.
I can assure you that I am working hard to make sure that RBS workers who clock out after 5 pm will receive time and a half for overtime, in order to compensate for the replacement of cash bonuses with IOUs.
In addition, I will insure that RBS associates receive two twenty minute breaks (one in the morning and one in the afternoon), in addition to a one-hour lunch break.
-Ken Feinberg
Posted by FriendlycornerMD , Nov 04, 2009 12:57PM
The funniest part is that RBS is going to have to give away Sempra for a song because those are the guys earning the biggest bonuses. Nice work boneheads.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 12:58PM
Debt is current dollars plus accumulation of interest minus external factors, to be paid sometime that is not now.
Can I be a trader now?
Posted by European Bear , Nov 04, 2009 1:00PM
@32,perhaps but then only the European branch office.
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 1:01PM
@47:
External Factors >> @sum (current dollars..accumulated interest).
Posted by Anal_yst , Nov 04, 2009 1:14PM
@38
Its a rip-off of Ahnold's IOU plan for Cali
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:18PM
@49. In this case, little doubt about that.
47
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 1:20PM
@ anal_yst:
Ultimately, JP Morgan provided a private loan to California to retire the Ah-nold IOUs. Perhaps JP Morgan will do the same for RBS, and it will all turn out good in the end.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:24PM
The one positive consequence of these deferred/capped bonuses is that it will eventually push up base salaries. I have always thought it was odd that you could be an MD with a multi-million dollar bonus, yet your base was only $250k.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:25PM
bwaahahahaha, I hope they all declare bankruptcy. eat shit and die
-john q. public
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:34PM
@53: Please tell that to RBS management. Base salaries have not budget and aren't forecast to. Incredibly meager base, but again - thankful to have a job in the "salaried waiting room".
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 1:36PM
@54=bho
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:51PM
Could not happen to a nicer bunch of losers! Not a brain cell to split between them. I say cut their base to minimum wage. You still won't see any of the jackasses leave because no one will hire them anywhere. Goes for front office, back office and everything in between. So long suckers!!!
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:52PM
@55
The "salaried waiting room"? It's my understanding that you're only to be brought out when the queen tires of fox hunting.
Release the hounds!
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:52PM
@56
Who is BHO? I think I like him.
-Nancy P
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 1:58PM
Why is my groin engulfed in flames?
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 2:03PM
Why does my ass hurt?
Posted by Anal_yst , Nov 04, 2009 2:33PM
If we use the "fancy new(ish) office" single-factor model, (see BoA, RBS), does that mean Goldman is now a sell?
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 2:36PM
how can they pay so little money to all that talent???
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 2:43PM
Bone Us is the new Bonus
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 2:52PM
At least we have this nice new office to work in.
-looking on the bright side of a pile of shit in Stamford
Posted by Xenu , Nov 04, 2009 3:37PM
This is what happens when you work for jerkwater firms in places like Charlotte and Scotland, it must suck being unable to get hired at a real firm.
Probably more money in being a SEIU 'organized' these days anyway, at least the taxpayer funding goes to you directly, in cash.
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 3:50PM
@66: That's the spirit, man! The SEIU (formerly AFSCME) is the fucking union that works for you!!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3mw49mk_x0&feature=PlayList&p=6E76D2457786FF89&index=0&playnext=1
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 4:25PM
I just re-read this post and it's still hilarious to me.
-Fred G.
Posted by pfluger , Nov 04, 2009 5:01PM
@59-
Just turn on the TV and wait for a few minutes. You'll see him. He will be the black guy with the raised chin and expansive gestures who swivels his head from left to right repeatedly, at 3-5 second intervals.
Posted by guest , Nov 04, 2009 10:40PM
The Queen's Bitches will experience more fun in the morning when they realize my Corgis have spent the night shitting the trading floor. Scoop the poop before you trade the fade.
--Anonymous in Buckingham Palace
Posted by guest , Nov 17, 2009 11:28AM
You should all leave RBS!!! They lie to you and then stab you in the back with a "Crappy" bonus...Maybe I will just tell my mortgage company that I am "deferring" my mortgage payments until June of 2010...Hey wait a minute I could have borrowed some money from RBS and then only paid a 3% interest on the money I should have already gotten from them......Get out while you still can!!!!!