The Swiss are scheduled to communicate bonus numbers today. In the meantime, those working in UBS’s O’Connor fund are preemptively pissed re: the news their compensation will be structured as though they were regular old employees of the bank. What are they doing about it?
Making phone calls, is what!
Traders are contacting other hedge funds and recruiters after UBS AG (UBSN) moved them to a pay structure used throughout the firm, said the people, who requested anonymity because their plans to leave aren’t public. That resulted in immediate cash bonuses falling by 50 percent to 1 million Swiss francs ($1.06 million), and some deferred pay being tied to five-year UBS bonds rather than reinvested in O’Connor funds, the people said. The potential defections show the struggles the biggest banks may face in retaining top traders at internal hedge funds amid shareholder and regulatory pressure on pay and rules that limit how much of a firm’s capital can be invested in the funds. “This structure is analogous to working within a bank,” said Ilana Weinstein, chief executive officer of New York-based search firm IDW Group LLC. “But what’s the likeness of O’Connor? It’s a hedge fund, and this structure is not competitive with working at another hedge fund.” [...] The unit’s core Global Multi-Strategy Fund returned more than 8 percent to investors last year and more than 10 percent annually since its June 2000 inception, one of the people said. O’Connor’s trading teams report to Chief Investment Officer Dawn Fitzpatrick and the group’s traders include portfolio manager Kipp Schrage, the person said. All employees who made more than $250,000 in 2012 had at least 60 percent of their pay exceeding that amount deferred, UBS said earlier this year. The firm also lowered its cap on immediate cash bonuses to 1 million francs last year from 2 million francs for 2011. O’Connor traders will get half of their deferred pay in five-year debt that can be canceled if UBS’s Basel III tier 1 common ratio drops below 7 percent, the people said. The ratio under fully-applied Basel III rules stood at 9.8 percent on Dec. 31.
Unfortunately, while making a show of talking to recruiters might work at another firm, to the extent it’d get management to sweeten its offers for fear of losing talent to competitors, UBS doesn’t appear to be concerned about the potential defections. According to alternative and quantitative investments head Bill Ferr, people aren’t working there for the money anyway.
“We believe our people choose to be here based on a combination of our team culture, access to client capital and UBS distribution,” Ferri, said in an e-mailed statement.
UBS Said to Face O’Connor Hedge-Fund Defections on Bonus [Bloomberg]
“We believe our people choose to be here based on a combination of our team culture, access to client capital and UBS distribution”
Just like you thought I was a good trader!
Suckers.
“We believe our people choose to be here based on a combination of our team culture, access to client capital and UBS distribution.”
Last week I shoveled my next door neighbor Mr. Jones' driveway. He asked if he could pay me $1 in cash now and $24 in Jones CoCo bonds that will become instant wallpaper if he loses his job anytime in the next five years. I told him to pay me $25 in cash now or I would shovel all of the snow back on his driveway if it was the last thing I did in this life.
-11 year old who didn't change his "green stuff cash only" policy even after Mr. Jones reminded him of the great culture in the cul-de-sac.
Nobody chooses to be at UBS
Nothing. Why? They work for UBS.
Ass, Grass, or Cash baby!
-UBS 1960/70's Culture Quant
UBS is the biggest loser/underperformance culture ever! When do they finally shut this IB down: it's insane.
Maybe, just maybe this so called "company" would have money to pay bonuses if they didnt employee one guy to wash their buildings with nothing more than a burnt red t-shirt and a spray bottle. I mean am I right? Am I right? People AM I RIGHT!
We generally just stick to 'UBS Sucks' around here. No need to say anything more.
What a bunch of Shazars.
O'Connor rolls up under Global Asset Mgmt.
O'Connor is a FOF shop so it's not like there's some secret sauce/algorithm here. But they suck too!
Hahahahahaha!
not even chuck norris would be able to fix this shithole aka UBS.
Know what you mean.
- Guy who is going to miss seeing Hess employees out painting everything white all of the time.
How are the words "retaining top traders at internal hedge funds" used in connection with a fund that returned 8% in 2012 vs. 13% for the S&P and 16% for the nasdaq?
You trying to start something?
Not losing money hand over fist = top trader at UBS
Apples to Oranges bro. Round these parts we grade on the binary scale; +/-.
Situation at UBS IB
- comp sucks. Donuts across all levels even MDs who have brought in business
- for those getting paid, structure sucks. What value do you put on 40% of bonus deferred for 5 yrs (hint, rhymes with hero)
- management focused on costs, not generating revenue
- further cuts likely
- no more lending unless around an m&a trade/bridge or tied to an IPO
- shutting regional/country offices (LA, France, Toronto, others)
Thus, Zurich either trying to cut costs and risk so far that IBD doesn't impact rest of firm / share price but can still say they are a global financial leader with an bank (and can compete against CS) or they are trying to pretty up the IB to sell. No way they can think the situation is sustainable since employees have shifted all resources to updating resumes
That sounds really bad, you should definitely come work here.
Most hedge funds made less than 8% so its a relative outperformer.
Not downvoting for the idea, merely the execution.
Do you keep commenting just to try to set a reputation score record?
Maybe I was never part of the "elite" club to begin with, but what exactly are people expecting? IBD deal flow and hours are not nearly as exhausting as they used to be (at least not in most of the industries covered), equity sales and trading is maybe 50-60 hours a week tops. So while it's not government work, it's certainly not unmanageable and you can get home to see your kids/family.
Not to sound cynical – but unless you were formerly a really senior MD raking in 6 & 7 digit bonus numbers, how big were the bonuses to rank and file guys to begin with – 30? 40? 50k?
Even at 50k that's obviously a good chunk of change, but you probably went from 50k down to 20k down to 0, would be very shocked to hear that it was cold turkey 50k to zero year on year.
I'm as eager as the next person to max out comp, but you'd think people were wronged 10x over the way they are moaning.
The bank lost money – yes it was many years ago, but if you were a shareholder, would you ask other shareholders to take the hit or push it into the business? Hard to stomach as an employee but at the end of the day we're a business not a charity. If you're still stressed about how you didn't get paid, then either pack up and seek your value elsewhere, or recognize that really you are getting the best deal you can.
All this being said, I do sympathize that senior management has done a poor job of managing the IB through the crisises their former leaders created and agree they have – no – need to get their act together on what the F the future of the firm is meant to be and stop playing catchup with their competitors.
You touched me. I too am a rambling man.
Little guys at 30-50k? You taking IT or Operations buddy. Not IBD or even trading. Fresh MBA grad associates puledl 100k bonus, 2-3 years out you talking 250-300K BONUS
We gave Mike Stewart 10mm in bonus money! We couldn't believe he gave it all to Pete,Jonah and that dope Jason! Sorry about that.
Bob
UBS gave out more doughnuts today than Duncan Doughnuts, including a bunch to our newly promoted MDs, that is just so special!!!
and Goldman interns pulled 8 digits just to walk around the floor (UBS floor) for a couple of minutes…
For what you say to be reasonable, you'd have to convince us that life for VPs and below at UBS is freakishly good relative to any other IB. Otherwise, if you're working 65 hours / week or more, can't leave town on weekends, never more than arm's length from your phone, etc, your hourly pay is less than what the IT people are making, AND you have zero job security.
And if you're an MD and you can manage to bring in and close M&A business, you should get paid well for it. People can argue about the profitability of lending, capital markets and the other BS, but M&A is almost all profit (and no risk).
That's what the CDS markets for son ?
Hey !
I always think of OConnor UBS as an options house
What do you even need VPs for ? One MD, one analyst, the secretary and a rapid-testing STD kit is all you need.
Let me refer you to our Quantatative analyst for this question.
Who the f*ck is "Duncan"?
-Offended Pastry Quant at Dunkin' Donuts not named Duncan
Hey prick. Why should you make more then IT!? They have brains, skills and are actually employable elsewhere.
What in gods name do you think these people do. What you are referring to are he equivalent to credit administrators at wells fargo not revenue generation at a markets or advisory driven business. Superior businesses dont pay inferior salaries for too long. But then again. Sergio you know that
So I'm 42, I got bad grades in college, and I work in the back office of a bucket shop broker dealer that's currently under investigation by both the FBI and the DOJ (for real). I'm cool with my situation – my mediocrity, my NYC annonymity – and I know that I'm never going to set the world on fire. When you hit 40, you kinda come to terms with who you are – the good, the bad, and yes, the ugly. You relax. You realize that your dreams are never going to materialize, and you come to terms with the fact that it's not a crime to fill your Friday nights with toasted Quizno's signature sandwiches, sleeping pills, and leisurely beat off sessions in front of no frills Lenovo computers . . .
That Friday night ritual goes in what order
When IT?
It's John Thomas Financial, right?
You oppose his execution ?
That's got copyright infringement written all over it
Correction: I always think of OConnor UBS as an outhouse
You're welcome.
absolute return benchmarks using libor…make 8% look great. and more than 10% annually since 2000 isn't toooo shabby.